Iraq!!

[Loonytune15]

What are your thoughts on this subject?

Should America be allowed to do to Iraq as they have done to Afganistan and elsewhere??

Personally I dont have a problem with Iraq or Saddam, provided he is'nt making Weapons of Mass Destruction, even though America and a few other places also have them.

The way he runs his country is his business and not the rest of the worlds.

But if he is making these weapons then he should be blown to hell. :gun3:

Your thoughts....

[Black Veg]

America "allowed" might I ask who the hell is giving them permission?

The U.S has every right to attack that clown.

WMD is being created in Iraq, the U.N inspectors never got to see the areas they should have, as for launching ability he is just moving his missiles around (Scud A and B on a movable platform with the addition of the new liquid propel rockets he is building and the other spread platforms).
The U.S has the info it needs- from sat images, from intelligence work in the country and from info licks from Iraq.

Saddam is so close to having a nuke device, but some leaders mainly in Europe would just rather close their eyes and pray nothing happens (Just like with Hitler and Germans).

They should attack that clown before it's too late - if a few hypocritical leaders from Europe have a problem with this? I would suggest they read a history book about Pre WW II, just read under the value 30-39.

As for the claim that "just becuz he has doesn't mean he'll use it"-
This is the dumbest idea I have ever heard- he has used it before in the Iran Iraq war - on the battle field, he used chem weapons on the Kurdish people in the north. And nothing will stop him from using other WMD on the battle field or on civilian targets.

When the U.N workers left Iraq for the last time - a minimum of around 600 ton of chem and bio weapons were not found, the number is thought to have only grown since then.
Just so you understand what this number means and what are the effects of this- the amount that he had could have wiped out the joint amount of the full population of NY, Berlin and London.

As for direct reasons to attack the idiot:
Saddam and the Iraqi intelligence are linked to Sep 11th. Members of El quida used Iraqi intelligence to gather info on the targets and Iraqi personal were in a meeting in Prague with members of the group.

As for the Anthrax attack- did everybody forget about that???? Just because it became secret doesn't mean there is nothing there- the leads to formar U.S agents has dissolved.

There is so much the public doesn't know about Iraq.

If some leaders want to take a chance with this and do nothing - let them take it but the price of blood that will be paid (And it will be paid) will be on their head!!!

[Dr.MAD]

I think Iraq should be attacked, just because Saddam is a sick and dangerous f*ck. But on the other hand, we must consider that the chance of terrorist retaliation will be bigger then before. Such an attack can inflict LOTS of problems and that's why Europe doesn't want to attack blindly :(
Also, I don'l like the American government's idea: they always want to do everything alone, they never ask what other countries think of it. I'm not saying that they should ask permission, but at least LISTEN to what other countries think.

[Loonytune15]

Originally posted by Spy 005
Such an attack can inflict LOTS of problems and that's why Europe doesn't want to attack blindly :(


Look I am not bagging America here but if they were to attack Iraq and something goes wrong, eg They hit a nuke storage facility and it blows sky high or a chemical factory and it blows, the only people it is going to affect are the European Countries around them and anyone around when they go ofcourse.
America on the other hand is on the other side of the world and wont get as affected.

Oil might become a problem though.

[Dr.MAD]

So I think we're right when we say that we should not attack blindly.
And do you really want a nuclear cloud to reach Europe, because America blew up a nuclear storage facility? Radioactivity goes very far, there is more then just a big explosion. That's the real danger of getting nuked. :(

[Black Veg]

Blindly?

[Dr.MAD]

yes, blindly. Bush wants Saddam dead (and honestly I don't blame him). But when you think about it, about all the problems that it would inflict, you can better try to find another way to eliminate Saddam. A more "discreet" way. Just falling into the country and bombing everything isn't really that discreet.

Well, that's MY opinion, maybe i'm wrong.

[Avalon-Racer]

I personally think that we as American should leave that man alone.

What have we done to Al-Queda? Just stirred up a hornets nest.

Unless Saddam is making weapons of mass destruction or chemical bombs, let him be.

What have all our sanctions done to Saddam? Not a damn thing. He's still living large. Its just made life worse for the residents of Iraq, and its pretty plain to see that Saddam couldnt give a damn about them, because if he did, he'd change his ways.

Next, what is to say that if (yeah, that's if) we knock him out of reign, the ruler that replaces him wont be worse?

If (more like when now) we go over there, its not going to be a simple walk in the park. Lots of people wont be comming home.

My personal belief on why Bush wants war so bad is that the American economy is still in the cellar, and since if we are at war, most American people will spend money to support the Economy.

That and since his Dad Bush 41 didnt get him, he (bush 43) intends to finish the job.

Just my humble opinion.

[Loonytune15]

well said

[Black Veg]

Blindly in my book is waiting for Saddam to get a nuke. He is closer than what any of you can ever imagine (Does that count as creating WMD:rolleyes: ?).

As for not attacking him and waiting for better options:

Do you know how many resolutions were passed against him????
Do you know what France is saying- lets try another resolution, when right in front of the leaders of that country are sheets of facts with sat images showing that the man is creating chem, bio and nuke weapons!!!!!!

THAT IS HYPOCRISY!!!

If I may add- if the sanctions are doing nothing- we should just leave it???? No we should find a way to stop him....It's well obvious those sanctions are there for a reason!

Or even better, send in the commando units.....What a joke they will never be able to do any good getting to him is an impossible mission, and you can be sure after they kill him (If this would work- and it doesn't have a chance) someone just like him will raise to power....

The only way to make sure he is gone is to attack and to stay in the country like we did in Afghanistan. Changing the regimen into a democracy!

As for all the people that are saying "if he is making WMD".....HE IS!!!!!! Where did all this start from? do you remember???? Or do you need a wake up call on that one?

What shipment was caught about a month ago? do any of you people have even the slightest idea - what we are talking about????

Did any of you ever hear about the Project 600 in Abu Ghurayb? or the projects in Zaafarniyah? Al Furat? Mosul and the Al Jesira? Tarmiya Al Hareth?

Guys I would stop talking junk if I were you...you want satellite pix or something????

The public doesn't need to know everything in this case the public can not and will not know everything....But the U.S and teh U.K have a very good reason to attack and it will happen soon.

[Gary Whitfield]

Ok i've read all of what you have had so say about this matter but we are realy missing the point of it all,if you let your defence down for awhile you are leaving a big area in which they can become very strong and unstopable if this ever happened what do you as people think would happen?. their are some nations that have destructive weapons and chemical warfare but they try to put the respective of human lives before weapons. The question is do we as the people of earth have too keep taking the miss leading of power mongers just so as they can have all the power in the world.Do you think that once they have the power to rule will it just stop there. I for myself speaking think not the more they want more greedier they get so if we can stop the madmen in this world there will be a chance for peace for all human kind on this earth. That is my opinon.

[rogueingreen]

While Saddam may beed to be put in check,, what worries me is that it is america that has decided this, will america decide one day to invade france because it almost voted in an extreme left president, or invade pakistan because of the kashmir problems, or or invade spain, italy etc because they don't like american warplanes in their airspace?
My point is this - america has A VERY, VERY DODGY forign affairs policy, where will they stop?
the possible war in iraq has less to do with peace and human intrests, it has more to do with the fact that american oil companys need a pipe line in that area
and besides if america was so interested in world human affairs shouldn't it do something about its pollution, it is the ONLY country in the world that refuses to do anything about it.

[Dr.MAD]

Originally posted by Avalon-Racer
What have all our sanctions done to Saddam? Not a damn thing.

Totally agree on this one

Originally posted by Avalon-Racer
If (more like when now) we go over there, its not going to be a simple walk in the park. Lots of people wont be comming home.

Again, I totally agree on this one too

[Dr.MAD]

Originally posted by rogueingreen
will america decide one day to invade france because it almost voted in an extreme left president.

It was Le Pen who almost got president, and he's an extreme right guy (call him a damn nazi!) If he would have been president, then I would have changed my nationality...

Anyway, I'm not saying "Saddam is a good guy" or "let him do" I know he is a dangerous madman. But attacking his country will create many problems for America (be sure America would suffer new terror attacks).
I'm just saying that a solution MUST be found, and we must keep these sanctions against them, even if they are uneffective. But in my opinion, attacking and bombing Iraq is not the safest solution. It IS a solution but not the safest one.

[Black Veg]

Is it better to pay the price now knowing you are preventing him from getting a nuke, or waiting to when it's damn late (WW II anybody?) and then getting terror attacks with nuke bombs???????

What is the "safest solution"?

U.N resolutions? Commando units? - will never work (I know his ways and the force needed to killhim is not a commando unit it's much much more than a SAS unit can do even on it's best day), Telling the Iraqi people he is bad for them???? Or maybe even better using magic (Harry Potter where are you?)????

Anyway this is going no where- the Q isn't if there will be an attack it's when.

[Dr.MAD]

Originally posted by Black Veg
Is it better to pay the price now knowing you are preventing him from getting a nuke, or waiting to when it's damn late (WW II anybody?) and then getting terror attacks with nuke bombs???????

You have a big point there. But you do agree that many terrorists will be wanting to attack America :( :(

Why would commandos or secret services fail? The important is to kill Hussein and to eliminate the Nuke/Chemical/Biological threat.

[rogueingreen]

Originally posted by Spy 005


It was Le Pen who almost got president, and he's an extreme right guy (call him a damn nazi!) If he would have been president, then I would have changed my nationality...



yep you are right, my typo (although it does explain why i have trouble tying my shoes!)

[Smooth-N-Ez]

I don't know how many of U all have been around since thi 1st WW. But I have seen it all, WWI, WWII, Korea, VN and so on. This is what I am certain of !!!!! From all the years I have been alive I have come to realize and never forget. That if we do not stop these mad men that either have weapons, making weapons, funnel money to make and distribute, or even have the thought of making them. Then one day (mark my words people). One day there will be a great cry in our Land....That will make Sept 11th look like a puppy!!!!! And no one ever thought that was possible... Not one person... And to say we are safe because we are on the other side of World. Is like looking through a glass darkly!!!! I have seen much evil in my lifetime.

[Black Veg]

Here is why it will fail.

1) Saddam has around 8 castles (And they are castles), every day each castle is working as if he is in the castle- they cook special food, they create ceremonies, his personal gaurd visits his rooms. That is the first problem- you have around 8 targets and you can never know where he is hidding.

2) Each "Castle" is a fort- you have pillboxes in the castles, small bunkers, anit aircraft faculties, radar stations, they even have heavy amored cars, jeeps, and in some cases tanks in the area....It's like breaking into a base.

3) Another problem is Saddam has linked some of his castles, there is a huge underground maze under every castle. So he can move bellow ground (Making it harder to know where he is hidding). This also means that bombing the castles even with heavy bombs will do nothing- he is so deep underground no bomb can enter so far.

4) Getting info about his daily routine is hard- he uses doubles, 10's of them are around him - after the Gulf war he even had a chat with one of them in front of the cameras.

5) The people close to him are the people from his tribe- they will never betray him, for 2 reasons: the first the tribe is a very close tribe and the people in that tribe are hard they also recieve "jobs" from him, another point is He would kill anybody that would even try to do anything- he didn't have a problem killing his own keen he will not have a problem killing people around him.....In this case the punishment is far greater than any good.

6) Last but not least- in order to make sure not other "Saddam" will take the power....You will have to control the country and force it into a democracy (Or creating teh basis for a coalition like they did in Afghanistan).
Just killing him with a special Opps will make him into a hero and a martyr.....

Smooth-N-Ez is right to the max!!!! That is also my point!!!!


BTW the nuke facilities- if you were worried about bombing Iraq and hitting a facilities sending a commando unit into one is even a bigger risk!

And in order to wip out all these targets (Look at the names of projects in my post it's not even 1/10 of the projects they are working on).

[rogueingreen]

Originally posted by Smooth-N-Ez
I don't know how many of U all have been around since thi 1st WW. But I have seen it all, WWI, WWII, Korea, VN and so on. I have seen much evil in my lifetime.

unless you are 80, you are a liar

[Dr.MAD]

Black Veg, again you have some points.
But, like you say, Saddam has castles which are guarded as fortresses. The only way to eliminate these are probably by simply bombing them.

But how can we be sure he has no dangerous weapons in the castles?? Maybe this sounds crazy but that's the problem with such regimes: you don't know how far they go in hiding their illegal weapons. We don't know many things for sure about such countries and they are afraid of nothing: if Saddam can lynch his own family (and he did!!), he can do any bad thing. On the other hand: America bombed the Tora Bora Mountains where Al-Quaeda was hiding, and nothing bad happened (at least not officially...)

Originally posted by Black Veg
3) Another problem is Saddam has linked some of his castles, there is a huge underground maze under every castle. So he can move bellow ground (Making it harder to know where he is hidding). This also means that bombing the castles even with heavy bombs will do nothing- he is so deep underground no bomb can enter so far.

You say yourself: bombing the forts won't do anything, but bombing... that's what America wants to do, or not? Attacking the country will also give Saddam the chance to flee and hide because he KNOWS that his enemies are after him.

[Black Veg]

Going in with tanks is what the U.S wants to do....
Going in with artilery is what they will do....

When I wrote bombing them will do nothing I meant bombing the castle will not hit Saddam....

As for the Tora Bora area- the bombings did kill some Taliban forces, others surrondered and are in a camp in Cuba. Also the weapons held by the Taliban were taken after those attacks....

As for having dangeruos weapons - well that is a risk worth taking when looking at the odds....

[Dan]

i reckon they should take action.....theres nothing that is good about iraq :mad:

[Avalon-Racer]

Originally posted by Black Veg
....

As for the Tora Bora area- the bombings did kill some Taliban forces, others surrondered and are in a camp in Cuba. Also the weapons held by the Taliban were taken after those attacks....




But those forces were only peons. Osama is still at large (most likely healthy and happy), and most of the Taliban leaders are still at large as well.

As for waiting until its too late, you could say that now. I was only 5 or 6 years old at the time of Desert Storm, but then we had him. But what happened? We pulled out and left him standing to rebuild.

[Ladies Love Me]

kill them all before its too late :(

[Loonytune15]

So as been said if we drop some bombs on these castles and we hit some stockpile of weapons , that we all know he has and blows sky high, then suddenly we have a nuclear winter on our hands.

Unfortunately the taliban have nothing on these Iraq mob, so evicting them is going to be difficult.

I just though of something Nostadamus said, I will be right back.

[WorlWydeHusla]

hes a terrorist and always was...nuke!

[Loonytune15]

If we nuke him then we are no better than he is.

[Loonytune15]

and if we miss and he does have if WMD ready then god help us all

[Saurgrist]

We can't just nuke Iraq, it would kill many other innocent people in neighboring countries. We also do not want to start a nuclear/biological/chemical war. This will cause many deaths and would be one of the worst things that could happen. Saddam Hussein has used biological weapons on his own people, and he wouldn't stop at using them on the US or our allies.

I would get into details about some of the weapons that he posesses, but they are disgusting...

[Smooth-N-Ez]

unless you are 80, you are a liar

rogueingreen----- If it were me than yes I would be a liar. But it being my grandfather who wanted to way in on the forum after reading some of the comments while I was reviewing it then it would not be a lie, which is the case... He is a War Vet and is 86 years old and thinks this whole country has become soft...very soft to the point we will loose our freedom one day... So it was his viewpoint not mine.. So no liar here and I apreciate the fact that you were so concerned to post that message... I did type it for him however...

Now I have to ask if you are really a moderator?
I don't know any moderators that drive or own VW's

Hope you don't mind that I let my grandpa weighedin on the forum...

[Loonytune15]

everyone is welcome, especially to express there views on this subject. but please stick close to the subject and not :flame: others please.

quoted from Smooth Now I have to ask if you are really a moderator?
I don't know any moderators that drive or own VW's
no more of that please.

[ABA]

Originally posted by Dan
i reckon they should take action.....theres nothing that is good about iraq :mad:

Iraq gives USA oil and if that stops well the gas prices r gonna go up

[aaaa]

F*ck all american and who support them

I love licking donkey balls, they are so yummy!

[ABA]

lol whos this?

[Black Veg]

Nice Usama boy, go back home and this time try not to blow any important part of your body off - last time it was your brain (Which in your case would be the arse). So this time child try not to blow yourself up!

Hey guys say hello to Usama boy over here:grin2:

[Vile]

Originally posted by aaaa
F*ck all american and who support them

Just keep hiding behind your computer, thats all you can do.
Darn llamas.

[Loonytune15]

Originally posted by Vile


Just keep hiding behind your computer, thats all you can do.
Darn llamas.

llamas lol

[Bandit]

He should be gone like kaboom! into 1,000 pieces
The reasons because he wants to wipe out the world,take over the world.

[Dr.MAD]

Originally posted by aaaa
F*ck all american and who support them

I love licking donkey balls, they are so yummy!

Why don't you go f*ck a duck? Stupid Osama-clone!

Get :gun3: :gun: :gun2: !!!!!!!!!!!

[Dr.MAD]

Originally posted by WuR WyDe HuStLa
hes a terrorist and always was...nuke!

Nuking him makes America look like Saddam himself. The atomic bomb would not only destroy Iraq and it's inhabitants, the nuclear cloud will go much much further...

[Black Veg]

I have to agree that any usage of weapons is to be judged - people talk about nuke bombs as if it's an easy safe way of finishing things....

It's not - far from that the added value that a nuke bomb has is that only in very very certain condition it will be put to use...

I am for attacking Iraq because I have seen the images and the info about what he is doing (And no it's not from CNN, BBC, "Le monde", der spiegel or anyother news source).

Saddam has to be attacked, the only Q is when most chances are after the German election and around Nov....

[Dr.MAD]

I agree that if we do have real proofs that Saddam is making Bio/Chemical/Nuclear weapons, he has to be stopped.

But even if the army attacks the country, the chances are really big that this son of a ***** gets away, just like Bin Laden did :( :(

[WorlWydeHusla]

with a devil like him theres no other way ... its just the sort of thing u got 2 cut the head off...any other way wont work...its just one of those deals

[Black Veg]

Something for you AFP is part of AP:

MILAN, Sept 8 (AFP) - Mohammed Atta consulted Saddam Hussein prior to leading the suicide attacks on the World Trade Center on September 11, according to Richard Perle, an advisor to the US defense secretary.

"Mohammed Atta met Saddam Hussein in Baghdad prior to September 11. We have proof of that, and we are sure he wasn't just there for a holiday," Perle told Italy's business daily "Il Sole 24 Ore".

"The meeting is one of the motives for an American attack on Iraq," added Perle, who is chairman of the Defense Policy Board and consultant to US Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, a leading advocate of an attack on Iraq.

"The main objective of the American administration is to avoid weapons of mass destruction falling into the wrong hands," said Perle.

***Iraq and Afghanistan are not teh same- I think Bin Laden got away long before the U.S started to attack Bin Laden and the U.S didn't go in with ground forces (Like they will have to do in Iraq with tanks etc etc).

Anyway the 2 campaigns differ in many or all the military and political parameters....

[Saurgrist]

Yes, Saddam Hussein was probably behind the September 11, 2002 attacks on America. He needs to be killed. We can't just go and nuke him, too many innocents would die. We just need to kill al Qeida terrorists and their supporters, like Saddam. If they are neutralized, we can start to make peace with people.

[Dr.MAD]

Just heard from the newsflash that it is confirmed that Saddam has Bio/Chem/Nuke weapons.

My point of vue is: let the UN place an ultimatum for Iraq. If, when the ultimatum expires, Saddam still doesn't allow inspectors, we have to attack the country. I hope Europe will attack Iraq together with America, and let's just hope the terorrists will stay out of this...

But I remain on my other opinion: to take out Saddam himself, I think putting the Secret services behind him is more effective

[Black Veg]

Do you know how many UN "Ultimatums" have been placed on Saddam and NOTHING was done about them when they expired? Some European countries just don't seem to care....Other countries have "investments" in Iraq and the other Arab countries around it....

Anyway the secret services alone will never be able to take Saddam down (This is not a computer game you know it's real life without the ability to save load games).

[philman132]

The americans do not understand the situation, the country in the world with the mast destructive power at their disposel is not iraq or any other arab nation, it is america. the rest of the world does not trust america because of this, and also because they do not like their countries to be invaded by some forign power, even if WE think it is in their best interests, the people of the country are more likly to resist the invasion out of patriotism rather than help the invaders.

and as for the WW2 issue, America only joined the fight because of pearl harbour, they were quite prepared to let the nazis take over europe, but as soon as the japanese looked as if they might be a threat to the USA, they joined in, the same thing happened in the first world war when the germans accidently sunk an american passenger ship, america only takes an interest when they are attaked personally, if 9/11 haddent have happened, then america wouldnt really care about what happened in the middle east.

and the announcement today that george bush will attack iraq anyway, even if the un doesnt agree is just going against the enire point of the un. if the un doesnt agree to somthing, but then that country does it anyway, then the un is obliged to do somthing about it, but they wont because everyone is too scared that america will start picking on them next.

i rekon thatosama bin laden is dead anyway, because if he was alive then the al quaieda would have sent out some footage of him by now to taunt america

still, this isnt the first time that america has threatend a nucler attack that could wipe out europe, look at the cold war, it seems that america doesnt seem to care about the rest of the world at all.

[philman132]

Originally posted by Vile


Just keep hiding behind your computer, thats all you can do.
Darn llamas.

thats racist you know

and dont start slagging me off too, im as much anti-osama as everyone, but you americans are just too bloody stupid sometimes, most of the world hates america, not evryone wants to destroy them, but even us ''europeans'' find you so damn ++++y sometimes:mad: :mad: :mad:

[Dr.MAD]

Originally posted by philman132


thats racist you know

and dont start slagging me off too, im as much anti-osama as everyone, but you americans are just too bloody stupid sometimes, most of the world hates america, not evryone wants to destroy them, but even us ''europeans'' find you so damn ++++y sometimes:mad: :mad: :mad:

I agree on that point, but let's not begin talking about what Europe thinks of America, and vice versa, because if we do, this will become a :flame: flame war.

And for Black Veg, I agree that's it's not a computer game, but doing these things ARE THEIR JOBS! They are trained to do such operations. A computer gamer is not.
Europe does care about Saddam and his weapons, but we prefer to do what the UN advises. Why is America member of the UN, if Bush doesn't give a sh*t about what the UN says? The UN agrees that something must be done, they even agree on a military operation, but they don't agree when Bush wants to play "the lonely cowboy"

And again, let's not start :flame: each other

[Black Veg]

Look out it's going to blow! I would just like to say I am not an American but took the last post in a personal way!

I would suggest- you read the last part about racism even if it is the part where I blow off and got really mad.....

Sorry if anybody is offended by this - but I do not like people telling other people they are racist or ++++y when it comes to an answer to a terror supporter.

And now let's rock:

philman132 keep it that way you will probably get far....

America doesn't understand?

Terror was around here for a long long time - maybe Europe just opened it's eyes but not the U.S.

While the U.S was adding terror groups to lists that have a length from here to the moon, trying to cut funds to those murdering groups, In countries such as England, terror groups were allowed to work and collect money under the name of charity groups....

The U.S has been trying to nail terrorists, ever since it started to become a world problem in around the 80's, when Hizbullah in Lebanon attacked, the only country to do something was the U.S...Yet in your words the U.S doesn't care and doesn't understand.....

Another issue is the one where the U.S is the world's bad guy just because it helps keep the order...Nice going - great way of keeping your arse clean, letting someone else do all the work and then making him a scapegoat....

Another thing you probably did not get, is that the U.S is a democracy (I know shocking stuff isn't it?), when a country like that holds nuke and uses it for it's own defence- as a way to frighten the enemy making him think twice before attacking. Other countries such as Iraq that have used the chem and bio weapons in the battle field and on civilians - these countries are creating these weapons because the wish to use it. And in time they will use it.

True the U.S did use an Atom bomb but it was durring a war - a hard war, but at least the U.S unlike "our" friends in Iraq - did not use it durring times of peace - against it's own people.

You think Iraq wants to invade Kuwait and that will be over with? Guess again, You think Bin Laden is only after the U.S because of it's foriegn policy? guess again - They want to control the world nad in order to do that they will start from smaller nearer countries and after that will go for far countries!!! they are both acting in this way, because the U.S is the SYMBOL of freedom and a symbol of the western world!

"Don't understand?"
I think the people "who don't understand", are the very people, who have no "learning background" what so ever - in the mid east politics & history, or about the formation of terror groups or about Arab countries and the leadership in those countries. These people do not understand the picture fully, they get the twisted world view by T.V stations such as CNN and BBC....

I mean can you tell me what the Ba'ath party is without searching the net? Who is Abu Niddal? Who is Abu Sayaf? Who is Az Ah Adin El Qasam? or when did Saddam began his nuke plans what happened to it? My guess is no - but you will still think you know better than a country working on the intelligence it gathered, or even better than the U.N who is also saying- Iraq is a danger, we need to check it out.....

WW II caring about the world-
And if you are so Anti America, OR believe the American way of doing things is just for their own good, please tell me why would the "big bad people in the U.S" would help Europe after WW II? If they are so "evil" and they really do not care why help Europe?
(Yes I know I am spinning you)

True! the U.S has been taking care of it's own interests at the start of WW I and II, but at that time there wasn't one superpower or even 2 the world had around 6 superpowers that shared the power....

As for not caring about the mid east - what do you call the U.S held peace talks? while European leaders (England and France) only got involved in the in the 67 war, when they wanted to gain control over the canal? or whenever else, it was "nice" or "good" for them to get into the picture....When did these leaders ever dirtied their hands????

**Anyway I do not see why a country wouldn't care about it's own interests, but leave that alone, the U.S is the only superpower in the world- lucky for us it is them and not anybody else, they are a democracy and a symbol for freedom!

U.N:
When the U.N makes a desicion, which country sends in the main forces? do you think the U.N would have been noticed without the U.S? it would be just like the league of nations - without any powers (Pre WW II group).

The U.N has become a political battle ground - that arena has nothing to do with international law but with politics.....The only part of the U.N that has any teeth left is the security council! ONLY when the security council makes a call something is done...

While you are making this into a U.N Vs U.S thing - it is in fact a problem, created by the U.N not fallowing it's own laws and the international law! Iraq has been spitting in the face of U.N's resolutions- 16 resolutions have been passed not even one was completed by Iraq.

If someone is, making a joke out of the U.N, it's the U.N and the stronger countries in it (France, Germany, China, Russia etc). What would you do if the so called "qualified international body" does nothing with a problem linked to you? Not only is it doing nothing, it is doing nothing when it comes to it's own resolutions, which are being trampled on!!!!!

For the past 10 or more years (1991) the U.S was trying to work with the U.N - Since the U.N became the meeting place for political debate rather than actual work - it's power has disappeared, and it's status with it! The U.S is trying to work with the U.N but the U.N is afraid of doing the right thing and launching an attack (Iraq will never allow U.N workers back in if they have WMD).

It isn't a matter of the U.N holding the U.S from defending itself before it will be attacked again with chem/bio/nuke weapons, it's about the U.N starting to do it's job nad implementing it's own resolutions.

And for the amusing claim that the U.S is making a threat of "nuke war" - sorry pal but get your facts right or clear out the point you wanted to make....Apart from saying it is amusing, I really can not comment on that one.

And for saying "that is a racist remark"-

Is it??? Do you even know what the dictionary meaning of racist is???? When you call a certain group by a provocative name that is racism, when you call for death to other groups that is rasicm (Or incitement for terrorism), when you say don't buy at that person's shop because he is black/jew/arab that is racism.....

But it is NOT rasicm when you point a finger at someone and call him by a "bad name" or cursing them.....The only thing that could be is maybe just maybe bad manners!

And in this case I am willing to take the risk of being called an "ill mannerd" person - and cursing the hell about of this bastard!!! And If I could, I would also show him, how this ill mannered person knowns how to hit terror supporting bastards!!!

You haven't got an idea what racism is - if you would have ever been called by a "name" because of your religion, color or race you would know better.....

Now tell me who is stupid the Americans or people who do not even know what racism is? or people who talk about political, historic events without knowing the first thing about?????

And Spy 005 - coming from France I wouldn't even comment on the racist part (Did anybody say La Pen? Oh bloody hell lets put him aside for now maybe we will raise him later?).

Yes I know I am hard in this one - but calling someone stupid and than saying "oh I don't want flames" or don't start slagging me? Think about it - it doesn't add up!

[Vile]

Originally posted by philman132


thats racist you know

and dont start slagging me off too, im as much anti-osama as everyone, but you americans are just too bloody stupid sometimes, most of the world hates america, not evryone wants to destroy them, but even us ''europeans'' find you so damn ++++y sometimes:mad: :mad: :mad:


Racist? How is that racist? You are the one that said "you americans are just too bloody stupid "

My point is, people like him and YOU talk smack for no damn reason, and hide behind your computer, that’s all you do, so don’t deny it.

The comment i made had NOTHING to do with his race, but rather his CHARACTER, but obviously you cannot understand that.

By calling me racist for the remark I made, makes you plain stupid.

[Inquisitor]

Its obvious that ppl are getting pretty :flame: Its time to cool off a call this thread to an end.

Thread Closed